Keiser On Kidd: He Needs Monitoring
Tom Cade files a story on Mike Keiser, the visionary behind Bandon Dunes who has some blunt things to say about the work of David McLay Kidd, who designed the first course at the resort. Thanks to reader John for spotting this.
So I told him I'd heard a story that during the creation of the original Bandon Dunes course he had come out and took a look at the wild undulating greens that David McLay Kidd (the architect) was building, and had told Kidd to make them flatter. "Yes, that's true. I told Kidd to make the greens more playable, 'or I will fire you today.' Can you imagine getting fired from your very first job as an architect?"
Keiser's reining-in of Kidd proved that his instincts were good, that he knew what golfers would want and he knew how to handle tough men in a tough situation. Later, others would let Kidd do as he pleased, and they have since paid the price - while the Bandon Dunes course continues to garner global acclaim in the golf industry, Kidd's Tetherow design in Bend, Ore., which opened in 2008, is currently undergoing renovation of many of its greens because of unfavorable reviews; and plans are in the works to blow up the disastrous Kidd-designed Castle Course in St. Andrews, barely two years old, and on a once-in-a-lifetime piece of property at the Home of Golf in Scotland. "Kidd was left alone to do whatever he wanted (at the Castle Course)," said Keiser. "The committee from the St. Andrews Trust overseeing the construction never checked in on him."
Has anyone seen a story on the talk about blowing up the Castle Course? Why isn't Peter Dawson working on that redo instead of tinkering with Open rota courses to mask the effects of ineffective regulatory efforts?
Tuesday, April 26, 2011 at 09:08 PM
Reader Comments (36)
His re-do of the Ryder Cup course at Gleneagles is being significantly altered too.
If only there were more Keiser types around.
Is this part of the second redo you are talking about or is this a phase 3?
Kidd's re-do of the Gleneagles PGA Centenary was a complete bust; the Euro Tour initially refused to use his new seventh greenand it had to be re-done. The Nicklaus company has now been re-engaged to undo the re-do and do their own.
And the R&A and Dawson have no stake in the Castle Course; it's solely a St Andrews Links Trust property.
The infamous 7th green has been remodelled over the winter and is a lot better-I played it a couple of weeks ago-but if the economy was a bit better I guess they might have rebuilt it completely.
Nicklauus now only has to find a way of re-doing McLay Kidd's awful 12th,13th and 14th and do something with his own 18th hole and we might have somewhere near a 1/2 decent golf course!
Incidentally I have reffed for the Eurotour at the last few Johhny Walker tournaments and I can never recall us actually refusing to use the 7th green(maybe befoe my time?)but there was really only 1 pin position and the Tour were very much behind its alteration.
How a supposed top designer can have such a huge green with only about 10% of it in play is beyond me.
The Castle Course St Andrews, that thing that sits outside St Andrews , the 7th of its breed yet by far the biggest Black Sheep (or colossal White Elephant whichever takes your fancy) that has certainly not been loved let alone an honoured feature of that great golfing town in The Kingdom of Fife.
The great past designers must be rolling in their graves to see such a monstrosity built on land not fit for purpose. By the way this site was bombed in WW2 and I had hoped that there may be one or two unexploded bombs lurking, but having seen the construction of the course when the farmland was stripped raped before being totally terra formed into this poor excuse, not just of a course but a helter skelter ride pretending to be a St Andrews Course
One day the penny may drop and Customers/Clients might start to realise that courses must be built on Land Fit For Purpose, then care should be taken to lay/construct the courses, trying to retain that which attracted the client to that section of land in the first place. Just because we have the technology does not give us the right to savage the land to produce a carbuncle totally at odds with its surroundings.
Careful selection for a start that will help minimise costs which hopefully will reflect in cheaper Green Fees, but golf is meant to be a relaxing game played over Natures gift to us mortal men, but not satisfied with that we have to go and rip the spirit out of land and then have to nerve to talk about The Spirit of The Game.
The Castle Course is there to make money, that was the aim from start to finish, to cash in on St Andrews, TOC, The New Course, The Jubilee Course, The Eden Course, Old Tom Morris , Allan Robertson and the whole Spirit of the Game. Problem being you can’t fool all the golfers, some start to show their concern, others agree and soon a great deal of money will have to be found to modify this poor enterprise.
There is a lesson to be learnt, now that money and land is tight, it is even more important to select land fit for purpose that needs minimal terraforming, blends into it surroundings and does not cost the earth resulting in high Green Fees. We just need to look around to see that these courses can be achieved, really good courses for surprisingly very little cost – a classic example is Askernish Golf Club on South Uist Outer Hebrides Scotland – check it out their web site is http://www.askernishgolfclub.com/ and read John Garrity on Part 1 & 2 http://www.golf.com/golf/tours_news/article/0,28136,2049447,00.html and http://www.golf.com/golf/tours_news/article/0,28136,2066211,00.html
The Royal & Ancient Game of Golf awaits but not for the likes of The Castle Course – just what a total waste of money and I feel reflects poorly on St Andrews. Having said that I am a supporter of The Links Trust but not alas The R&A, but that’s another story.
Melvyn
Maybe you (or someone else on this fine site) knows the answer to this. I had always thought that the first course David McLay Kidd designed was Gokarna Forest Golf Resort just outside of Kathmandu, Nepal. I played it in 2003, and was quite taken with both the number of workers trimming the fairways with scissors and sweep brooms (perhaps the only connection Gokarna Forest has with Augusta National other than both being 18 holes!) and the presence of ball-stealing moneys all over the course. It was opened in 1999, the same time listed as Bandon Dunes, and the Gokarna Forest members were obviously quite proud of the fact that the same designer of Bandon Dunes had also designed their course. But, if you look at Kidd's website, Gokarna Forest isn't even listed in his portfolio. Yet, using the Google, one gets plenty of hits with "Gokarna Forest" and "David Kidd". Is this an example of a well-known architect trying to forget his less-than-stellar humble beginnings, did Kidd in reality not have that much to do with Gokarna Forest, or did the parties have some falling out where they changed the course or something and Kidd didn't want to be associated with it anymore? Or something else?
-LK
RE Gokarna Forest: I can't speak to the current relationship between Kidd and the owners, but David was flying back and forth between Nepal and Oregon while doing the initial routing and clearing work at Bandon. When he spoke to me, he seemed to take a lot of pride in his work on the Gokarna course, and some of his bavado comes through in the note he wrote for each hole One is described as "the most demanding, challenging, and nerve-wrecking hole . . .Few leave unscathed."
A last note on Mike Keiser: He was still his his role as a leveller of greens during the construction of Old Macdonald, but it's clear that his tolerance has been stretched. The greens have grown increasingly contoured on each new course. When David Kidd saw some of the greens at Bandon Trails, he was full of admiration, and he said, "Mike would never have let me do that."
I think this is a fair point, but it is a little off the mark. Had Kidd not been effectively reined in when building the first course at Bandon Dunes, I rather doubt that it would have been such an off-the-charts success. If the first set of greens was decidedly wacky, I think the ardor for the project would have been muted. One can make the argument that the greens on each successive course were allowed to be built in a more "adventurous" manner. The greens at Bandon Trails are among the very best in America, in my decidedly amateur assessment and the greens at Old Macdonald are just a hoot. My speculation is that Keiser was being conservative in the early development of the resort and once he saw the passion for the place go through the roof, he became more tolerant of slope on the greens.
Last point, Keiser is anything but a flat greens advocate. I'm a member of his much-heralded 9 hole Dunes Club in southwestern Michigan. That course has some fun and well-contoured greens. Not as nutty as the great Doak greens at nearby Lost Dunes, but plenty of slope indeed.
Thanks for the info on Gokarna Forest - any idea/theory on why it isn't listed on his website? My other guess is that he might have done it working for some other firm and they didn't allow him to use it. In other words, I really have no clue about why.
It started way before the dream, it finished when insufficient care was taken to choice the site.
Whatever else it is certainly not IMHO a course born out of St Andrews or its traditions. Yet the initial Green Fees were way out of order for a new untried course. It was built to get your money, is the sweet or bitter truth of the matter and as long as St Andrews was linked with it some thought golfers would pay – Pay, but are you getting value for money, I think not but each individual golfers has to decide, noting that just round the corner are some first class classic Scottish courses well worth their Green Fees, so why bother with The Castle?
Melvyn
Isn't the Keiser approach with the first course consistent with his concept of providing a PV like experience for the retail golfer without creating a course so punishing that the retail golfer would not return or, worse, tell all of the other retail golfers that the course was too difficult and don't bother going?
Your book on the building of Bandon Dunes was fantastic and a must read for any fan of golf and/or golf course architecture.
Well done!
JPB
I've played Tetherow a couple of times last year and I didn't think the greens were that difficult. The course was more challenging than Bandon, but the fairways were a lot narrower and there were fewer places safe places to miss on your approach shots. They had already revised some of the greens, but I wonder how much of the softening was done because the the business plan went from being almost exclusively private (with stay and play privileges) to being mostly a public course.
The one issue I have with both courses is that the holes are a bit scattered on the front nine of both courses. And based on my peek at Machrihanish Dunes from the 9th tee of Machrihanish, that may be his style. Choose what seems to be the best golf holes even if you're walking all over the place.
We go to Bandon every two years, and only the fact that it is a haul to get there and $$ stops us from doing it annually. A little slice of heaven.
Get ye to Bandon, Rick!
Has anyone played David Kidd's Machrihanish Dunes? I snuck over the fence three years ago near the airport landing lights along the ninth (I think) at the old Machrinhanish course, but couldn't tell much with a glance.
Machrihanish Dunes is a raw, wild links experience that will delight if you prepare yourself mentally. I've walked the course, but not played it yet. Kidd and Co, assisted by Euan Grant,grow-in super from St. Andrews, now at Turnberry, did an awesome job with a shoe-string budget and the strictest environmental guidelines ever set down for course construction. Some of the greens are a little severe, but they seemed more towards the challenging designation than over the top to me.
Keith, the solid super who followed Euan, was his assistant and has been there since the early days. The course is healing in well and maturing, but it will take time to achieve the more refined links presentations of other offerings.
While the routing is rambling, the holes are generally solid to very good.It is big golf and a stern test in tough weather. There is some blindness on certain tee shots and the first-timer can get their ass-kicked due to that uncertainty and mystery, particularly when the wind is up. Sadly, the lack of a quality caddie program has really hurt what would have helped golfers and improved the overall, positive reviews by raters and those playing this project.
With Machrihanish and the absolute cracker of a liitle gem that is Dunaverty, just down the road at the tip of the Mull of Kintyre, it's a great part of the world to spend some quality golf time on the links. I strongly urge anyone to visit, just do your homework and call ahead to arrange some good caddies.
I think the Castle Course is way over the top and needs loads of alterations and his work at Gleneagles was truly awful.I've never played Bandon but it looks great and people who's opinion I respect rate it highly so perhaps the jury is out on McLay KIdd.
Wouldn't it be much better if he could get the design right first time?!
I have a conference up in Scotland in two weeks and a time for a golf itenerary afterwards. Your info helps.
Thanks for the info - I hope to make it to the area someday. Until then, it will be where I play holes in my head, lol.
@Marky Mark -
You lucky dog...I have a round paid for (as part of an auction) at Machrihanish...I have no clue if/when I'll ever get to play there, but I figuresd it was worth it. Have fun!!
-LK
If I can be of any help at all with your trip then please let me know.I have a fair amount of 'local knowledge'!
Why are Members of your club not attending the Old Tom Morris Invitation Tournament hosted by The New Club St Andrews in September. Its only open to clubs that have a connection with Old Tom.
Tain started it off four years ago with Kettering next year and Crail in 2014
Melvyn