When you come to think of it that is the secret of most of the great holes all over the world. They all have some kind of a twist. C.B. MACDONALD
Naturally, as soon as this comes to light, Lehman hits it in the water but still salvages a 4.
I bickered today via instant message with one of the game's great scribblers over the merits of Sawgrass's 17th hole about midway through the 50 balls finding "Pete's Pool."
This scribe hates it. I love it as a once-a-year, one-of-a-kind spectacle even if in high winds it gets silly. (Oh, and I'm still not wild about the front hole location, but I love Sunday's back right spot).
On the Golf Channel's Post Game Show, Brandel Chamblee didn't hesitate to call the hole unfair and ridiculous.
Before you weigh in, here's Jeff Babineau on today's spectacle:
A year ago, 57 golf balls plummeted their way to watery deaths at the famed Island Hole. That was over four rounds. Thursday’s opening round at The Players nearly matched it. Playing in the final group of the day, Doug Labelle II and Bo Van Pelt deposited balls 49 and 50 into Pete’s Pool. The scoring average on the hole was 3.699, and there were nearly three times as many double bogeys (23) and “others” (12) as birdies (12).
Debate it at any 19th hole as long as you’d like – is 17 a good hole or freaky sideshow? – but the only thing the 17th lacks on its vast teeing area is a spot for medics to perform EKG tests. Amazing that such a little golf hole can cause such high anxiety.
Is it, ugh...unfair? Silly? Brilliant? A masterful match play hole and lame stroke play hole?
...PGATour.com more specifically. It seems that in the event of Tropical Storm Andrea making landfall Sunday evening, the Tour has enlisted Kenny G to serenade the champion, thus ensuring that all but close family and friends will stick around for this low point in major championship The Players history.
Thanks to reader Robert for this April Fool's Day worthy item:
In the first year of a new tradition, immediately following THE PLAYERS Championship closing ceremony on the TPC Clubhouse event lawn on Sunday, May 13, internationally-renowned musician and avid golfer Kenny G will perform a salute to the 2007 PLAYERS champion.
Does this mean he's going to do this every year? Or is there still hope they might enlist Celine Dion for year two? Fingers crossed here...
"It's a year of firsts for THE PLAYERS, and we looked for opportunities to enhance the Closing Ceremony to give guests a special finale to the tournament," said Executive Director Brian Goin. "We hope the crowning of a new champion coupled with a musical performance by Kenny G will be an ideal conclusion to a very special PLAYERS Championship on Mother's Day."
By the way, whose idea was it to end this thing on Mother's Day?
...on the TPC Sawgrass' 18th hole!? Are they on the grandstand? Is it a bug repellant?
The 17th hole "Pipeline" on PGATour.com is working very well and seems to be a much slicker telecast than Amen Corner Live. Non-annoying announcers, multiple camera angles and few commercials. Oh and great sound on the tee too so that you can hear some of the pre-shot discussions.
You know since I've been doing this blogging thing I've seen some soft questions thrown at Tim Finchem, but never have the assembled scribblers and inkslingers lobbed 'em up so generously before.
Let's start with the illiterate. Apparently this scribbler does not subscribe to any golf publication...
Q. Was Pete Dye involved in the revisions, and to what extent if you would?Who let Jeff Gannon in the room?
Here's another one:
Q. There's been a lot of unofficial talk about the purse this week. Can you confirm what the purse is and whether the final amount is a world record for a golf tournament?Wow, they clocked that one at 19 mph!
And Finchem's answer, also available in oh, every major or minor publication:
COMMISSIONER TIM FINCHEM: Is it a world record? The purse is $9 million. The record part I'm not -- I'd have to defer to our brain trust over here.
JAMES CRAMER: We'll have to look. We'll research that.
COMMISSIONER TIM FINCHEM: I've learned over the years never to jump in and say, "Yeah, absolutely."
Well, except when Manougian said "how about 15 years?"
Back to the fast balls...
Q. What was your reaction to Tiger calling 17 gimmicky, being that it plays such a central role in this tournament?
COMMISSIONER TIM FINCHEM: I read the transcript. It doesn't trouble me. There are an awful lot of players over the years who have not had a good time at 17 for whatever reason. It plays -- you know, his suggestion that maybe it should be No. 8 is an interesting one. It plays as No. 8 -- everybody who's ever played the tournament has played it as No. 8 because we have a two-tee start on Thursday and Friday, so they have that experience. He's the first player I've heard suggest that we move it to No. 8 on the weekend. We don't intend to do that. I saw in his comments he used the word "wonderful" related to the hole, so I like that part.
Q. It was somewhat confusing. We weren't sure if it was wonderful or gimmicky.
You can just feel the tension in the room! I bet Tony Snow reads this and thinks, I have it easy!
Q. You're now 33 years into this thing. Every year we come here and there's always the question fifth major, is it a major, isn't it a major. Where do you see that argument going or that discussion going, and how does it get -- Jack yesterday said maybe it could replace one of the existing four. What do you see happening down the road here?
Yes, what would a Players press conference be without a fifth major question?
Wait, finally something tough...
Q. Does Tiger and to a lesser extent Phil have more influence on TOUR decisions and how the TOUR is run than other players?
COMMISSIONER TIM FINCHEM: No.
Wow, we know how to stop the Commissioner from rambling!
Nice follow up too:
Q. And if not, do you think there's a perception that they do and how do you confront that?
Here's where the rambling answer unravels a bit:
I continue to be amused -- I'll give you one example. I just read an article here this week that said that the reason for the FedExCup was because Phil and Tiger wanted a shorter season. That's just wrong. It actually had nothing to do with the FedExCup. I mean, it's true that Tiger and Phil at one point or another have said, you know, I'd like to see a shorter season. I think lots of top players over the years -- a lot of players generally have said I'd like to see a shorter season. Why is that? It's a long season. It starts in January and goes until November. And you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see that if you're going to end the season with the TOUR Championship and it's well into the football season, that's a challenge.
So we wanted to convert that to a system where we could have a good solid season to a section of our season and maintain solid playing opportunities for the membership, so we managed the situation where we have $32 million in prize money in the fall and we have the FedExCup, and these guys can decide how they want to use that platform. I think there is way too much written about that subject from a perception standpoint than relates to the real world.
Oops, we launched into nonsensical MBASpeak mode. You know what that means? Translation: Phil and Tiger wanted a shorter season.
More hard-hitting stuff:
Q. As a fan of all sports, I enjoy Major League's Homerun Contest or NBA's Slam Dunk Contest. I don't know if it's in the works or not, but would it be asking too much to have a TOUR long drive contest this week in the future since there is no Pro-Am?
And here's where Finchem's saying to himself, "I picked the wrong week to stop wearing deodorant."
Q. What is your assessment of the way the FedExCup race is going, and do you see it picking up even more popularity as it continues?
Our assessment right now is it is an absolute plus for the TOUR and for tournaments and for sponsors and for the players, no question. How big of a plus, we'll have a better sense of after the Playoffs this year, and then we'll see what happens next year. But if we get a good base late this year then I think we'll be in good shape for next year.
I think we have to be careful to remind fans that this is in addition to everything else we've had. It's not in place of anything. It doesn't take the place of some things that the Money List stands for. It doesn't -- it is not in competition with THE PLAYERS or the PGA Championship or any of that. It stands for what it is; it's a season-long competition, and I'm delighted that the players see it that way, are supporting it, and I'm pleased that from my perspective, maybe not 100 percent, but virtually all the players that are in those top seeds going into the competition will play all four weeks, which that would be the first time that ever happened in this sport, and I think it would be pretty exciting.
Wow, that was productive.
They won't be framing this John Steinbreder column on the TPC Sawgrass monstrocity. As he did in the wonderful Club Life, Steinbreder puts the new structure's excess into perspective.
For one thing, a clubhouse should never draw more scrutiny than the course, or courses, it is designed to serve. It should be, at most, a compliment to the track on which the rounds are played, and only a secondary point of interest.And more importantly...
My fear is that its vast size and scope might inspire others to go to similar extremes when building or modernizing the places where they don their Eccos before a round, much in the way Green Chairmen have for years responded to the impeccable look and lushness of Augusta National by attempting similar feats on their own tracks, often with disastrous results. The temptation to follow in those footsteps can indeed be great, and only the most sensible and steadfast club leaders will be able to ward off fellow members who decide they must have at least some of what the folks at Sawgrass have, no matter how inane or incongruous those desires may be.
And I think they find the new TPC clubhouse a tad excessive! Or at least, they'd like to see that new player's lounge get some use (check out Adam Schupak's tour at Golfweek.com).
I believe Wednesday at The Players means Tim Finchem will come down from his new clubhouse patio and answer questions from the assembled inkslingers. Just a few contributions, naturally, please post yours in the comments section.
- With the PGA Tour looking at reducing field size at Tiger's mid-summer event and cut sizes possibly being reduced, have you considered stepping up efforts to deal with the pace of play problem?
- Do you see any connection between the pace of play issues and the distance explosion of recent years in the form of longer waits on par-5's and driveable par-4s, narrow fairways, more rough, tucked holes, etc... and if so, do you think an easier solution to this problem might be a slight rollback in the ball?
- In the current Sports Illustrated, 73% of players polled said the PGA Tour should get tough on performance enhancing drugs. Can you update us on where your efforts to develop a tougher policy?
- Do you or any of your senior vice presidents own significant shares of Comcast?
Whoa Nellie how did that get in there? Hey, just want to squelch that rumor before it spreads...eh, too late.
- Harding Park is going to be a future playoff venue in 2013 or 2014, can you see the Western Open returning to a summer date that year so that you can retain a tournament in the nation's third largest market and restore a full field to this one-time "major."
- Tom Pernice, Great American or The Greatest American?
Thanks for all of the memory-jogging nominations for great greens in the game. The chapter got a whole lot easier to write.
Though I noticed no one really got too excited about my 17th at TPC Sawgrass nomination, and now I read in Doug Ferguson's piece that Tiger the architect thinks the 17th is poorly placed in the sequence of the course. Kinda spooky I know, but when you are going with the whole Fazio thing in your design business, the overriding theme is bound to be dull design.
“I’ve always thought that hole is too gimmicky for the 17th hole of a championship,’’ Woods said. “I think that would be a fantastic eighth hole, but not as the 71st hole of a tournament, or 17th hole of your round.’’
Thankfully Geoff Ogilvy was around to lend some more rational and thoughful perspective:
“If that was just a bunker around it and not water, you’d probably find more people would hit it on the grass,’’ Geoff Ogilvy said. “There’s something about water that does it to people. It’s a fun hole. I’m glad it’s here. You wouldn’t design an island hole on every course in the world, but it seems to work here. It’s cool.’’
And because this is my clipping archive, here's the lowdown on Tiger's Dubai design partner associate, again from Doug Ferguson's notes:
Among those watching Tiger Woods at the Wachovia Championship last week was Beau Welling, who used to be the top designer for Tom Fazio and played a big role in the redesign of Quail Hollow.
But his presence had more to do with the future.
Woods has hired Welling to do the work on Al Ruwaya in Dubai, the first golf course for Tiger Woods Design. The golf course is supposed to be done by September 2009.
Woods said Bryon Bell, whom he hired as president of Tiger Woods Design, found Welling after looking at the philosophies of various design companies.
"Beau fit what we wanted to have happen," Woods said.
Dubai is the only course in which Woods is involved, and he did not say whether he would continue to use Welling for other projects.
Welling now has his own company, and golf course design is not his only interest. He recently was appointed president of the U.S. Curling Association.
Tim Rosaforte has the TPC clubhouse at $60 million, which sounds possible.
And he offers this stunning stat, courtesy of Hank Haney:
I called Haney a day earlier to get educated on Tiger's latest conquest, and he made several enlightening points. No. 1, in Tiger's last 15 stroke-play tournaments, he has finished first or second 14 times. That didn't sound right, but we went back to last year's British Open, included a couple of second-place finishes in Asia, special events like The Target World Challenge and PGA Grand Slam, a runner-up at The Masters, and other than a T-22 at Bay Hill, Woods has indeed finished no worse than second only once in his last 15 medal-play events. His lead over Jim Furyk in the World Rankings is more than Furyk's gap on the No. 1,000-ranked player in the world.
The rest of the piece includes quotes from Haney with this "I don't know what more he can do" tone, implying that the quality of Tiger's play has been questioned?
Anyone know what he's referring to, or is this just typical neurotic star golf instructor paranoia?
It'll be interesting to see how this concept for the TPC rough plays out. Personally, I think we'll see shorter rough allow for some dynamic recoveries and some really, really stupid decision making. Both good things for us fans.
Garry Smits reporting:
Bermuda rough: Since the 1995 Players, 4-to-6-inch overseeded bentgrass rough was the norm. The course had to be overseeded with the hardier strain of grass to get through the winter because freezes could occur within days of the tournament when it was in March. The Bermuda grass will be cut to about 2 to 3 inches.
The result, from a competitive standpoint, is that players have a better chance of reaching the greens. However, balls sitting down in Bermuda rough are called "flier" lies because they have a tendency to come out hot. Upon contact, grass is caught between the club and the ball, reducing spin and increasing distance. Players must adjust their club selection accordingly, and it's a guessing game that two-time Players winner and Tour Policy Board member Davis Love III of St. Simons Island, Ga., said will create more drama.
"It was boring," he said of past Players Championships with higher bentgrass rough. "Most of the time, all you could do was hack it back onto the fairway. But in 2-to-3 inch rough, you maybe have a shot at the green. The issue is whether you picked the right club."
I'm in the midst of writing something and need your help. (Hey just remember, no pop-up ads, no animation junk...I'm allowed to take advantage of the brilliant minds who check in here).
So, I'm trying to write this chapter on my ideal greens and in thinking about it today, the 17th at TPC Sawgrass is one of my favorites. The green contours here are as much a part of the drama as the water.
Most of all I love the "compartments" that make what appears to be a one-dimensional hole so different from day to day. And I love how the key features of the green are memorable, a trait that encourages creativity and shotmaking. Because memorability of features on a green makes it more likely that players will be suckered into playing at tempting hole locations, moreso than they might otherwise try if a green before them were simply a sea of meaningless bumps.
Therefore, I'd love to know what you think are some of the best greens in golf?
Or to put it another, name a green (or a few) where the design supremacy of the hole is mostly dependent on the contours, size, shape and angle of the putting surface.
Don't be shy. There are no right or wrong answers. Just help for a lowly writer.
It's Monday of fifth major week, which means no one has much to write about. So Jason Sobel and Bob Harig try their best to be like Brittle and Gorse over at GolfDigest.com by doing their alternate shot shtick. Let the fifth major debate begin!
Sobel: Well, I've always disliked the notion of The Players Championship as the "fifth major" and I hated those snarky comments we heard throughout the week about the Wachovia Championship becoming the "sixth major," according to some of the pundits.
Oh I don't think Andrew Magee was being snarky! You did mean Andrew, right? Lord knows, the word snarky has never been uttered in the same sentence as moi!
That said, it was an enjoyable, memorable weekend of golf from Quail Hollow, culminating in Tiger Woods' 57th career victory.
It's one they'll talk about for weeks. I know I enjoyed thinking about not watching it at while I lounged at the beach.
Of course, it's the same old story: Did Tiger outplay the field in Sunday's final round or did his fellow contenders simply wave the white towel and get out of his way?
Harig: First things first. The idea of a fifth major is ridiculous, no matter how good The Players Championship was, is, or might be. So a sixth is even sillier. A Grand Slam in baseball does not consist of five runs scoring on a home run, and one in golf does not include five (or six) tournaments. And it never will. Too much history would have to be rewritten. And then there is this: When was the last time you saw 19 of the top 20 in the world play the week prior to a major? Probably never.
So cynical Bob!
Meanwhile Doug Ferguson spent Monday trying not to get lost in the new clubhouse, unlike Geoff Ogilvy.
“I’m a little lost,’’ U.S. Open champion Geoff Ogilvy said. “It’s such a big building.’’
And Doug did the fifth major thing, and he comes out firmly that The Players remains the fifth of golf's four majors.
“I think enough fun has been made of their place in the golf kingdom,’’ Sluman said over the weekend. “There are still only four majors, but it is an unbelievable golf course with bar-none the best field in golf.’’
Shouldn’t that be enough?
PGA Tour commissioner Tim Finchem has said that he only wants The Players Championship to be the best it can be, and he has stopped at nothing to accomplish that. The Tour wants the tournament to be known as “The Players,’’ similar to “The Masters.’’ Television coverage will include only four minutes of commercials every hour, just like the Masters.
The winner of The Players gets as many FedEx Cup points as the winner of a major. In the World Golf Hall of Fame ballots, The Players is listed in bold print alongside the four majors.
“Nobody likes being force-fed,’’ Sluman said. “I think everybody associated with the tournament needs to let it take its course. It will find its spot wherever that ends up in five, 10, 15 or 50 years. But just let it happen.’’
Ogilvy called it the fifth-best tournament in the world, which probably is what The Players Championship is. But what inevitably followed were more examples of what it’s not.
“It’s not a career-defining win,’’ he said.
Can't you get fined for saying things like that?
Geoff Shackelford is a Senior Writer for Golfweek magazine, a weekly contributor to Golf Channel's Morning
Copyright © 2022, Geoff Shackelford. All rights reserved.
